[phatbubble]

the planet saturn ends retrograde motion and goes direct this friday, 21 feb 03.

this means that as seen from earth, saturn appears once again to be moving 'forward' in its orbit. saturn is associated with restriction, reduction, limitation, shrinking, constriction, disappointment, consequences, dues-paying, the status quo, and slow and steady progress. in greco-roman tradition saturn is synonymous with chronos - Father Time. ol' Big Daddy Bummer.

i didn't realize until last night that saturn turning retrograde nailed two major intermediate bottoms, and signified the onset of significant bear market rallies. note how, in the chart below, during the retrograde periods the SPX lofted freely above the trendlines connecting the start and end dates....and during the direct periods, the market resumed with the status quo: slow and steady progress into reduction of assets, disappointment, and realization of consequences. the red and green trendlines on the chart pretty much speak for themselves. unsurprisingly, the consumer confidence & sentiment charts display the same trends.

what are other astros saying?

Quote

"This period is the final culmination of the Saturn/Pluto cycle.  This is very likely, of course, to have a negative impact on the stock indices.  When the planet Saturn went retrograde on Oct. 10th, it was the bottom in the stock indices.  The direct station should have a potent and negative effect on investor sentiment...."
-astroadvisor.com

Quote

"Saturn direct (in Gemini)....almost as bad as it gets for tech stocks and technology in general, almost as good as it gets for self discipline"
-astromaggi.com, 26 dec 02

Quote

"While Saturn is turning direct and obstacles and delays may be lifted, do recognize that Saturn continues its transit of Gemini, ruled by Mercury thereby continuing delays regarding travel and communications. We have certainly seen Saturn’s influence in Gemini with the crash and burn of various companies in the telecommunications industry these past two years."
-Frank Don, Winter 2002-2003 predictions

Quote

"Predicting the stock market is iffy. Nevertheless it is possible to make educated guesses based on history. I'd like here to make an educated guess that markets will crash and probably cause panic in the last two weeks of February 2003. I base my surmise on a planetary pattern that has always coincided with crashes and/or panics going back to 1857. I hasten to add that not every time this pattern has formed have markets crashed, but every time markets have crashed this pattern has been extant. So I view the pattern as a kind of economic hurricane warning."
-Robert Gover, stariq.com

plan accordingly.

Attached image(s)

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[PrtzlLogic]

Great post, Phat. Thanks for the info. My indicators have been telling me for months that the downtrend was not only coming in this timeframe, but also that it would do so in a brutal fashion. My shorter term E-wave counts tell me that this rally is nearly over, and my longer term counts say the next downleg will probably be the worst yet.

To see the astros confirm that is somewhat uncanny. I know some here bash the astros... I've stated that I remain open to them. The more times I see things like this, the more I consider they may indeed have merit for trading (assuming of course that this plays out the way we're both expecting).

(As an aside: one of the reasons I've always kept an open mind to the astros is that I know from experience that numerology works. Matter of fact, I'm pretty good at numerology. Anybody wants to have fun w/ it, throw me a complete date of birth and I'll tell ya quite a bit about your personality )

[WillytheBooh]

Hmmmmmmm OK!!!

June 5, 1959 4:30 am...

WtB

[Hoodwinked]

Phat great info....tanks. This has been a big part of Hoods trading plan.
We dont wnat to forget that pesky Mars opposition to Saturn on 2/20/03
In the US... Saturn SD 2/22/03 2:41 AM

[PrtzlLogic]

WillytheBooh, on Feb 19 2003, 05:08 AM, said:

Hmmmmmmm OK!!!

June 5, 1959 4:30 am...

WtB

I decided you may want to keep this more private. Check your PM's.

Pretzel

[chasmo]

phatBubble:
Great find! Last October I was so focused on Mercury seperating from the Square to Saturn that I did not think about Saturn going retrograde other than that it was slow in motion at the time of the long Mercury square to saturn at that time.
Trying to think symbolically about this.Saturn direct would indicate that Saturn could go about its primary work which in a bear market would mean restorng things to their true worth and destroying false notions about the worth of equities or anything for that matter that is over valued.Saturn retrograde then might indicate this process being temporarily put on hold and then revisting of old problems, like perhaps ie "irrational exhuberance"
So if this is the case and we are are still in an over valued bear market Saturn is about to go back to its job of telling us the way things really are and not the way we hope or think they might be via our fondest illusions.
In September 2000 Saturn went retrograde but we were at the time only begining the bear market their was not as yet a deep over sold hole to rally from.
I think what you have found here is most defnelty supportive of the idea some of us astro bears have that the so called spring rally will be muted as Saturn goes about its "grizly" work of showing the world the consequences of past excesses.
Iam not sure that this means the next time to cover ones shorts is October 25 2003 As Saturn again goes Rx but Iam sure if we have the expected long market sell off into the fall of 2003 there will be many who will be looking for a rally into the end of the year at that time.
That bloody Saturn sitting right on my Gemini Sun and I have been one uptight bear of late.Had a rotten tooth pulled last week that showed up on the day Saturn was to the minute of arc conjunct my natal sun.
Hood:
Another major storm due in the east in about 4 days but it wont be a true coastal storm so heavy snow from it will be inland but you still might get something from it.
The lack of snow here is Wiscosnin is just killing me and seeing what you have gotton is causeing real envy.
This next storm will actualy be more powerful than the last.
Atmosphere tends to go a little bit crazy during Uranian periods.Very cold air will again slide into the country behind it keeping the pressure on energy prices.
Iam still thinking as this last storm came on Presidents day it is indicative of trouble for the president as was the last one in 1979 for Carter.

[threadbare]

Pretzel, October 6, 1955. Thanks

[IrishJew]

Pretzel,

Nov 28, 1968

Thanks
IJ

[RockLedge]

I'm game Prtzl!

20 FEB. 1964

Tanks & Dungs alot!

[PrtzlLogic]

Uh oh. I didn't expect all these responses (you should see my PM's)

I'll try to get to all requests... 'twill take a while, though.

Everybody jes' gonna hafta be patient.

[WillytheBooh]

PrtzlLogic

sounds like me..... I remain open minded to be sure.... will let the mrs. review it first to see if see peceives the same..... you wouldn't happen to do loto numbers eh!!!!

Thanks WillytheBooh

[phatbubble]

chasmo, on Feb 19 2003, 04:27 PM, said:

Trying to think symbolically about this.Saturn direct would indicate that Saturn could go about its primary work which in a bear market would mean restorng things to their true worth and destroying false notions about the worth of equities or anything for that matter that is over valued.Saturn retrograde then might indicate this process being temporarily put on hold and then revisting of old problems, like perhaps ie "irrational exhuberance"
So if this is the case and we are are still in an over valued bear market Saturn is about to go back to its job of telling us the way things really are and not the way we hope or think they might be via our fondest illusions.

my thoughts exactly. well put.

[PrtzlLogic]

alex, on Feb 20 2003, 12:40 AM, said:

what exactly is "retrograde"? Does this mean when a planet orbits backwards?  

I'm no astro expert, but I found this link on the Wonderful World of the World Wide Web of the World: Retrograde

[phatbubble]

alex, on Feb 20 2003, 02:40 AM, said:

what exactly is "retrograde"? Does this mean when a planet orbits backwards?  

it's when it appears to move backwards in its orbit, as viewed from earth.

back when the Grand High Poohbahs of the church insisted that the earth was the center of the universe, astronomers use to have to construct all these convoluted and geometrically inane orbital structures to explain this apparent backwards motion.

copernicus proposed in 1530 in his de revolutionibus that things might oughta not work that way, and within a century bruno and galileo had both bought in. the church didn't take well to being downgraded to a market underperform; in 1600 bruno was burned at the stake, and in 1633 inquisitors forced galileo to renounce his beliefs under threat of torture and death, and he spent the rest of his life in prison. the cat was out of the bag, though.