Hypertiger Posted August 20, 2004 Report Share Posted August 20, 2004 Attachment of interest to the medium of exchange is a product of absolute self indulgent reason...So the primary cause ultimately is Human beings which due to employment of Absolute self indulgent reason create flawed logical algorithms that must have lies and self delusion as inputs to cover up the flaws... I point out Interest attached to the medium of exchange because that is the key... It is the reason why debt is growing larger and larger...In a debt backed by debt system the medium of exchange is debt... Why eliminate Humans? Only militants and those caught in the crossfire need to be eliminated...Those who mind their own business and accept their fate without resistance are not a real problem... When the system reaches maximum potential it will be impossible to input non negative or greater than previous inputs into the compound interest equation...The other supply demand equations will also have to "deflate"... The only thing in short supply during the Great depression was debt inflation... When debt can not inflate anymore then it implodes (hyperdeflationary implosion) and since debt is what fuels the massive division of labor make work project that implodes too... It is hard to eat without a source of income...If you can't request a commercial bank to create debt out of thin air or there is no employment and are not willing to suck cock to obtain an income stream then the rate at which you turn into a skelleton accelerates significantly... Starving people wandering the streets or gangs of criminals are evidence of the systemic flaws in the system and must be covered up/eliminated...For 6000 years the SOP has been to round them up and put the flaws into work camps which turn into death camps... Massive slave labor factory hives are currently in operation in China's interior. row after row of Huge multi story apartmet complexes filled with bunk beds and surrounded with fences and check points churning out trinkets 24/7 to support the compound interest equation... It is just a quick fix with a finite lifespan on top of all the other quick fixes which have self destructed...It just allows the suck from the bottom to the top to last a little longer... The end result is a hand full of wealthy individuals supported by a massive sprawling slave labor death camp infrastructure... Actually it becomes so illogical that it all just self destructs and is unsustainable anyways... You have to realize that the most unproductive members of society are those at the top...Rejection of that reality is only a product of Absolute self indulgent reason and ultimately self delusional... I could go on and on and have been but I candy coat and cut short most of my posts since you all are very close to the top...Unfortunately you are not high enough in the economic food chain to escape responsibility for your actions...You will obey or die...it's that simple... The top's social engineering of the bottom has been going on for almost 100 years and accelerated the last 40...I assure you that most of the bottom is brainless or gutless or both...Minor amounts of stress that could previously be shrugged off and or effectively delt with now cause a complete cave in...I've seen plenty of examples...Of the talk the talk but when it comes time to walk the walk total cave in happens... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dummy Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 Thanks for reply. The top's social engineering of the bottom has been going on for almost 100 years and accelerated the last 40...I assure you that most of the bottom is brainless or gutless or both...Minor amounts of stress that could previously be shrugged off and or effectively delt with now cause a complete cave in...I've seen plenty of examples...Of the talk the talk but when it comes time to walk the walk total cave in happens... And your belief is that they will be go AP3$H1T during the hyperdeflation, leading to the crackdowns and camps, etc.? I can buy that. Massive slave labor factory hives are currently in operation in China's interior. row after row of Huge multi story apartmet complexes filled with bunk beds and surrounded with fences and check points churning out trinkets 24/7 to support the compound interest equation... The above rang a bell, as I am reading Gulag Archipelago, a book that everyone should read, but most won't for the very reasons they should. The gulags were not exactly about supressing specific dissidents or anything like that. A lot of people ended up in the gulag for no other reason that the police had quotas to meet, and they were the most convenient people at the time. Kind of random, skinner-box style. What I don't know is where the quotas came from. Was it to increase economic output from the camps, or just to maintain a steady arrest rate to keep the rest cowed, or just an arbitrary choice. Economics is a political tool, and so in the end this is all about power politics. In the world right now, there are no physical limits that our economy would run up against. Despite what some might think, there are no limits on energy, food, etc. There is enough. People that can't agree to that can at least admit there was enough globally when Russia and China and America and all the others put people under yokes before. So this is not about natural resources. When things go nuts, the reality is that the people that were working one day could work the next, they could get their money, and they could buy their food. Just like the 1001 days before. OK, it will take longer than a day, but still, what will have really changed? But they won't be able to this time, because the system will not work. That, to me, is an apparent Paradox. I guess I am still trying to get it. Do you have a list of books that you found to be worth reading? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hypertiger Posted August 21, 2004 Author Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 No physical limits? The primary cause of this mess we are in is the religious belief in the attachment of interest to the medium of exchange... All the other problems are secondary causes and effects... Until the primary cause is addressed all the other secondary causes and effects can not be addressed... As soon as you try to address them they conflict with the primary cause. Interest attached to the medium of exchange is part of the economic algorithm Also all interest is compounding interest...I'm not going to explain that, if you don't think so fine...you win and I lose because I'm not going to hold your hand and explain something so simple and will not play games with people who want to play dumb... The compound interest equation is the only part of the alogrithm which contains exponents... For the algorithm to work the inputs into the Compound interest equation must never be negative and must be greater in size then the previous inputs... Or the economy collapses then violently implodes... In order to satisfy the inflationary requirements of the compound interest equation all the other equations in the algorithm must be inflated by the required amount... population, food, energy...etc There are Natural finite limits built into all the other equations which can only be bent and manipulted so much...social engineering and scientific innovation have finite limits. The perpetual inflation of supply and demand equations to satisfy the inflationary requirements of the compound interest equation has a finite limit... With the compound interest equation the required amount of inflation is never enough until the required amount needed becomes infinite... Then the system implodes. It could be you are suffering from the just think positive inflation forever social engineering you have recieved. But you did mention the word paradox... Deflation is infinite and indestructible...Inflation is finite and fragile... Deflation does not increase or decrease and has no beginning and no end... Inflation increases and decreases and has a beginning and an end. truth is infinite and indestructible while lies are finite and fragile... The truth is something while lies are nothing... or Something is infinite and indestructible and nothing is finite and fragile... Yipe... If the truth is that deflation is infinite and indestructible and does not increase or decrease and has no beginning and no end then that is zero. The truth is zero? but the truth is something which would make it 1 while lies which are nothing would equal zero but nothing is finite and fragile... The Universe is a logical construct of Infinite finiteness or the Never ending end... The Universe is a paradox. It has a beginning and and end...But the beginning and the end are the same point in infinity...Basically a circle but we see waves... I could go on but it is ultimately up to you to decide... You have free will...I provide information...that's it...I have answers but they are my answers...You can accept them or reject them. It is possible to maintain existance within the bounds of reality but for the past 6000+ years the humans who position themselves at the top of the economic food chain reject reality...They reject truth. Absolute self indulgent reason... The end result is always ruins and self destruction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiHat Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 The paradox of "system", is that it IS a negative. The chief feature is to turn out people whose core drive is one of SELF HATE. People will put up with much..........even annihilenation..........in order for said hate, to bear fruit.................... In order to prove a negative, DEATH must be chosen................................. Given the premise that compound interest accrues from something that does not functionaly exist.......anti-matter?..........Destruction is rational. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dummy Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 HiHat: I'll be pondering that self hate thing, a meme to keep us all paying that interest, and then not pipe up when we can't keep doing it... HT: No argument here that compound interest is arbitary and destructive system. Especially when the interest is high, and the people with most of the money are allowed to stack monolithic rubber check after rubber check on top of each other. debt backed by debt backed by debt... So its not just the compound interest, which will always end up growing debt faster than the population, it is the stacking of the compound interest, which makes debt blow up even faster than that, pulling in the blow up date far nearer than before. Whats my point? that the rates of interest and the permission to stack the compound debts on top of each other is a political choice. On the other hand, that people have the innate ability to generate work, and that the world has resources for those people to make goodies, are not political constructs. They are fundamentals. Money, debt, and the rest are just tools to get the work done to make the goodies. Mental tools. People can change their mind. Problems if defined, can be solved. You have defined a serious problem which, in my opinion, most likely has a solution. But the possibility of finding the solution and implementing it is remote because the parasites at the top don't think it needs to be solved. And they have, as you said, made almost everyone stupid, complacent, lazy. Including themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sasquatch Posted August 22, 2004 Report Share Posted August 22, 2004 Dummy makes an excellent point: You have defined a serious problem which, in my opinion, most likely has a solution. Hyper, regardless of all the algorithms you derive to prove the system will fail, all it can prove is that the current monetary system will fail, which is not to say that there is no solution to the dilemna. The system currently works, people toil and produce goods and services which they turn around and barter for the goods and services of others who toil and produce. This primary system is a functioning one. Currently the US owes other countries for their goods and services as the savings consumed by Americans is not their own. But as long as their are resources that are needed and labor that is necessary, there is employment somewhere. What is needed in my mind is a global restructuring, wherein the US standard of living must fall while those of developing and producing nations must ultimately rise. The reason for this is the staggering debt each American owes personally and as a US citizen of a debtor Nation. American assets, be they financial or real are hyperinflated and will at some point deflate, likely when debt implodes. When the $USD fails there will be a replacement, it is afterall not a tangible asset in and of itself, but a unit of exchange for goods and services, which is the real unit of production in an economy. So who really loses when levered assets deflate, when debt is defaulted? Will every American lose their homes or will the debt be adjusted down to the deflated and restructured values? Where will the pain be? Who carries the paper? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dummy Posted August 22, 2004 Report Share Posted August 22, 2004 So who really loses when levered assets deflate, when debt is defaulted? Will every American lose their homes or will the debt be adjusted down to the deflated and restructured values? Where will the pain be? Who carries the paper? Sasquatch, some good questions. HT: I think I remember seeing in the archives that you, at one point, had suggestions for a way to save society when this sytem breaks, by restructuring things. It was a wish list, but I wonder if that line of thinking might still be useful, because it might point out the general lines of a non-doomsday scenario. Who knows, it may turn out to be beneficial for the parasites to follow a roadmap. My experience has been that if you can think of it, then others are also thinking of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hypertiger Posted August 23, 2004 Author Report Share Posted August 23, 2004 I never said I had a way to save society...There is no way to save society... I did start constructing a sustainable system but it is completely incompatable with all the religious beliefs of the past 6000 years... What you see right now when you open your eyes in the morning is a system that is ceasing to exist... The system that you depend upon to exist so you can exist how you've been trained to exist...I like it just as much as you do... But unfortunately it is in the terminal phase...any attempt to change the system will only cause the speed at which it is ceasing to exist to accelerate very rapidly... Nothing can be done... When you shoot someone with a gun in the head...Lets say because of a mistake...and they die...how do you save them? And this is not an Alan Greenspan deal...This whole system which is in the terminal phase began 311 years ago... Basically all we have done for 311 years is postpone the inevitable... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hypertiger Posted August 25, 2004 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2004 When someone that is starving asks for help and the person they are asking for help from demands as a condition more in return then they give... That is the end of civilization right there... From that point to the end result could be 100's of years and the entire time period before the end can be called civilization but the reality is that it is an inevitable countdown... As the years and decades progress people become less and less civilized and in the end all the people are doing is pretending to be civilized... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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