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The oddlar is the world's dominant medium of exchange.  The values of everything are expressed as dollars per unit. As dollars are destroyed the number of dollars available per unit of stuff declines. Therefore each remaining dollar is worth more.

 

The problem is that there were never as many real dollars as people thought. For every real dollar, there were 40 imaginary dollars.

 

 

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How can you be the world's dominant medium of exchange and at the same time creating imaginary dollars. That makes no sense.

 

You can not have the massive increases in money supply over the past 25 years and say it was imaginary. If these increases in money supply were fictitious then we are looking at riots and chaos going forward....and I am not talking just the inner city.......

 

 

In the end we either have to pay back all this debt or our country will loose all respect from the world and at some point foreigners will take their dollar reserves and say "shove it!"

 

If you are right then I guess the debt of this country is imaginary as well. :blink:

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Many smart people lost fortunes by buying the market in late 1929 and early 1930. There was still a long way to go.

 

Another thought. I'm guessing that many people won't forget the oil shock, and will continue to move toward fuel efficient cars. At least those people who can still afford cars. A lot more people will be riding the bus or their bike to work all over the world. And more cars will be fueled with nat gas.

 

But fundamentals shjczmundamentals. For what it's worth the long term chart of oil has a tentative price projection of 50 bucks next year. I'm not willing to bet against that yet, although the price today did hit a shorter term projection. There may be a trade here, but that's it.

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How can you be the world's dominant medium of exchange and at the same time creating imaginary dollars. That makes no sense.

 

You can not have the massive increases in money supply over the past 25 years and say it was imaginary. If these increases in money supply were fictitious then we are looking at riots and chaos going forward....and I am not talking just the inner city.......

In the end we either have to pay back all this debt or our country will loose all respect from the world and at some point foreigners will take their dollar reserves and say "shove it!"

 

If you are right then I guess the debt of this country is imaginary as well. :blink:

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Everything you say is right. What was, no longer is. What is, no longer will be.

 

Mass psychoses have been documented to have occurred many times throughout history. I highly recommend Mackay's Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds as well as Kindleberger's Manias, Panics, and Crashes. They are essential to understanding how mass psychology can be turned toward delusional behavior in the financial realm.

 

And it applies not only to the financial, but to the political as well, expressed as xenophobia and ultimately even genocide. The human race is capable of the basest stupidity and the basest evil imaginable, and even beyond imagination.

 

Yes, we face an uncertain and dangerous future.

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"Yes, we face an uncertain and dangerous future."

 

 

 

 

 

This can"t end good.....

 

Paulson endorses bank stock purchase plan

 

 

Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson said Friday that the Bush administration will move ahead with a plan to buy stock in financial institutions.

 

 

 

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081010/ap_on_...eltdown_paulson

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Many smart people lost fortunes by buying the market in late 1929 and early 1930. There was still a long way to go.

 

Another thought. I'm guessing that many people won't forget the oil shock, and will continue to move toward fuel efficient cars. At least those people who can still afford cars. A lot more people will be riding the bus or their bike to work all over the world. And more cars will be fueled with nat gas.??

 

But fundamentals shjczmundamentals. For what it's worth the long term chart of oil has a tentative price projection of 50 bucks next year. I'm not willing to bet against that yet, although the price today did hit a shorter term projection. There may be a trade here, but that's it.

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Doc, The analogy about 1929 is scrary at some point. Considering the fact you where right, do you really think this are comparable in term of economy. Could we see such a high level of uneployement for exemple. (it's gona rise of course).

 

Another thing, how in hell did they fool the market like that. I know, it gets hard to follow but damn, when a entire economy is based on exponentially leveraged fluffy money, more people should have ring the bell? Personally i think it is unaceptable from a government. Even me can understand snowball effect.

 

Edit: Quote: 'We face an uncertain future.'

 

Doc, are you saying this is worst than ever before? (recent history) It must be the shock, but i find this hard to beleve.(no you but the situation)

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Everything you say is right. What was, no longer is. What is, no longer will be.

 

Mass psychoses have been documented to have occurred many times throughout history. I highly recommend Mackay's Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds as well as Kindleberger's Manias, Panics, and Crashes. They are essential to understanding how mass psychology can be turned toward delusional behavior in the financial realm. 

 

And it applies not only to the financial, but to the political as well, expressed as xenophobia and ultimately even genocide. The human race is capable of the basest stupidity and the basest evil imaginable, and even beyond imagination. 

 

Yes, we face an uncertain and dangerous future.

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Doc I respect your opinion greatly. I have a hard time believing the gold market was/is in a mania stage. I have talked to hundreds of people that could care less about gold and think Treasuries are the ultra safe vehicle. If anything the Treasury market is in a mania stage rather than precious metals. My theory has always been that until people loose confidence in the US government or at least its debt you have not seen the ultimate top in gold in dollar terms. You can not conduct effective trade if most of the dollars created are imaginary. Please feel free to discuss this over the weekend.

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Doc I respect your opinion greatly. I have a hard time believing the gold market was/is in a mania stage. I have talked to hundreds of people that could care less about gold and think Treasuries are the ultra safe vehicle. If anything the Treasury market is in a mania stage rather than precious metals. My theory has always been that until people loose confidence in the US government or at least its debt you have not seen the ultimate top in gold in dollar terms. You can not conduct effective trade if most of the dollars created are imaginary. Please feel free to discuss this over the weekend.

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Gold isn't money, it is gold. When people think of money, they think of the US Dollar. They do not consider anything else money because for their entire lives they have known that the dollar is money. This is worldwide. The dollar is real money.

 

Gold is something that can be traded in for money, like an aluminum can, a glass bottle, or a chunk of silver.

 

Maybe 1% of the US population considers gold money, and sadly, they are in the minority.

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Many smart people lost fortunes by buying the market in late 1929 and early 1930. There was still a long way to go.

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ok, i have very little experience as an investor or as a trader. but i had a thought last night, after seeing so many people yesterday anxious to play a bounce, or to buy underpriced issues for yield/long term. or both.

 

the thought was, the odds of a quick turn off the bottom, a la 1987, seem long. much more likely i guess is a prolonged period before the bull rages again, like the 30s, the 70s, even the several months long interval of 2000-early 2001 of sideways prices for the dow.

 

i will leave the it bounce for you guys who know what you are doing. i'll play along with my gambling fund here and there. but i'm going to stop thinking about the 'buys of a lifetime' stocks, that i can pick up cheap monday, or next week, and hold for years of growth. i figure a lot of bargains will be around for at least months, maybe years to come.

 

although, damn if those decent yielding closed end funds, and ge with a 6% divi don't look tempting. of course, unless and until doc is right about the long bond.

 

(i just started rereading kindelberger's manias, panics, and manic-depressives or whatever it is called. useful perspective for times like these.)

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"Yes, we face an uncertain and dangerous future."

This can"t end good.....

 

Paulson endorses bank stock purchase plan

Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson said Friday that the Bush administration will move ahead with a plan to buy stock in financial institutions.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081010/ap_on_...eltdown_paulson

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money-down-toilet.jpg

 

The purchase of equity stakes in companies would be in addition to the main thrust of the $700 billion rescue effort...

 

:o

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$NDX...might have bottomed.

 

For Charles Mackay's classic work click on the link in my signiture.

 

The chapter for this downphase should read as...

 

"Extraordinary Popular Delusions and Madness of Bankstas and their Derivatives"

 

9 cents on the dollah for Lehman CDS's? There we go, we have a price.

 

While the world leaders are together a global cabal to enact laws to terminate...settled by Friday...ALL unregulated derivatives...and regulation put in place for any new derivative products.

 

FORCE the wingohockingmoyamensingas to get this shite off all books...by Friday.

post-565-1223690539_thumb.jpg

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Stockmarket "genius" Mark Cuban goes long and talks his book:

http://blogmaverick.com/2008/10/10/im-stil...arkets-go-down/

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Great! I'll love watching this swine get smoked.

 

Doc I respect your opinion greatly. I have a hard time believing the gold market was/is in a mania stage. I have talked to hundreds of people that could care less about gold and think Treasuries are the ultra safe vehicle. If anything the Treasury market is in a mania stage rather than precious metals. My theory has always been that until people loose confidence in the US government or at least its debt you have not seen the ultimate top in gold in dollar terms. You can not conduct effective trade if most of the dollars created are imaginary. Please feel free to discuss this over the weekend.

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I don't think we've hit mania yet. That probably won't happen until the banks take a holiday.

 

Although, all the gold-related banners on this site are ominous.

And that dude on CNBS who fondles a table full of gold coins is really creepy.

I wish they'd all go away.

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I just have this feeling that today's low will hold for a few 'weeks'.  :lol:

No, seriously..i think anyone that bought today will be in for a nice ride to the upside.

 

If i'm wrong, you can take this post and slap me silly.

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At least we know that we have far fewer sellers in the market

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Many smart people lost fortunes by buying the market in late 1929 and early 1930. There was still a long way to go.

Actually, if you bought in late 1929 and early 1930, you made out like a bandit -- as long as you sold by April. :D Lighten up, Doc, we're traders not eschatologists. :lol:

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