Dharmaeye Posted July 24, 2004 Report Share Posted July 24, 2004 This isn't anything new. It happened in Victorian times, in England. This is what stoolies should think about. Many people left Britain to come to North America and start over around the turn of the century, after the industrial "revolution" worked it's creative/destructive magic by pauperizing huge sectors of the population AFTER they left the land and had nowhere to go. Now that similar dynamics are occuring in U.S, where does one go? Canada? Perhaps. Though we are so tightly woven into the financialization matrix,it's doubtful it will be a safe haven here. Some thoughts-- The people who survived the Depression comfortably, were the ones who had fertile land, good water, could grow their own food and had no debt. Another thought. Those who left Victorian England did so with small groups of like minded individuals often formeing agrarian communities, based on some utopian ideal. Some failed, but some did okay. At any rate, it beat starving in Britain. It would be useful to read up on them. Observe peak oil theory and try to determine it's validity. If it appears to be sound, then will we not be stepping back in time anyway? Why fight the trend, go with it. Find like minded people, if possible, pool your assets, study, study study the situation, and then make a move. There are many small affordable farms in South and Central America, that could easily support a few small families and if resources were pooled, they could be purchased clear title. The legalities involved will be the trickiest aspect. Getting a jump on what may become a huge trend in the future, would be wise. Don't passively sit around waiting for the inflationary depression that's going to hit. Act now. I'm studying up on Costa Rica. Any thoughts? Aden sisters are in Costa Rica. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butterfield 8 Posted July 24, 2004 Report Share Posted July 24, 2004 If you are considering Central America, check out Escapeartist.com website. Panama offers title to land, 20 years without property taxes, low cost of living. Uses US peso. Laws are more favorable to US immigrants than Costa Rica's, benefits for retirees. http://www.escapeartist.com/international/0500_panama.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian4 Posted July 24, 2004 Report Share Posted July 24, 2004 Butters- I am sorry to hear that. I never, ever buy a Junior I stick to GG, AEM, PDG and a few others that are proven producers with large reserves and Yes they pay a small divvy. But cheer up cuz Gold is not done. Gold smells deflation so it will go down with the Market but the value it ultimately achieves will be much more than where the market ends up. Buying Gold stocks that have no production and no reserves are like grub staking a Prospector who knows the mother lode is just over the next hill-ya right. Thread- I wouldn't leave Canada-I think we are better positioned than most Countries to ride this thing out. Getting Rural-I agree with that-raising my own livestock, chickens and veggies and having a secure water supply is the way to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The End Posted July 24, 2004 Report Share Posted July 24, 2004 TE- in those nice pix of your family the other nite, you forgot the most important one-How's "Buddy" I am sorry to say Brian that Buddy has been put up for adoption. He is a very smart dog but way to aggresive around my little girl. Someone is coming today to see him. We are insisting a farm take him. I feel terrible about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 24, 2004 Report Share Posted July 24, 2004 FWIW, I really expect a major down week. My take on the economic new. Jul 26 10:00 AM Existing Home Sales Jun ( negative) Jul 27 10:00 AM Consumer Confidence Jul (down) Jul 27 10:00 AM New Home Sales Jun (down hard) Jul 28 8:30 AM Durable Orders Jun (down) Jul 28 2:00 PM Fed's Beige Book Jul 29 8:30 AM Employment Cost Index Q2 Jul 29 8:30 AM Initial Claims 07/23 ( bad) Jul 29 10:00 AM Help-Wanted Index Jun ( will be spun) Jul 30 8:30 AM Chain Deflator-Adv. Q2 Jul 30 8:30 AM GDP-Adv. Q2 (negative) Jul 30 9:45 AM Mich Sentiment-Rev. Jul (down) Jul 30 10:00 AM Chicago PMI (spun but down) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butterfield 8 Posted July 24, 2004 Report Share Posted July 24, 2004 Brian I sure wish I had known you when I was buying . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian4 Posted July 24, 2004 Report Share Posted July 24, 2004 Damn TE- I know how you feel-it is too bad it didn't work out -sending him to a farm will be a good thing. I know you well enough to realize that you waited as long as could. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stained jeans Posted July 24, 2004 Report Share Posted July 24, 2004 Demonstrators to be caged at Democratic convention How much more of this sh*t are we going to take, folks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 24, 2004 Report Share Posted July 24, 2004 TE, I had to put down my 8 year old female lead dog a couple of weeks ago. She had dried up and quite producing litters. I was going to turn her into a house pet but I caught her 3 weeks ago eating another females puppy. I really felt bad but with a grandchild on the way there was no way I would have felt safe keeping her around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 24, 2004 Report Share Posted July 24, 2004 I don't even own the stocks in my account as they are held "in street name", meaning the broker owns them. You own them Not your broker. When held in street name, the firm can lend them to short sellers until you sell. Let me add a bit more to this discussion of ownership of your stocks. Remember when few of us even knew that the Federal Reserve was not a Federal Agency? But we dug deeper and learned eye-opening new things. OK? Brian4 was correct. The only way to have your name on your stock certificates is to have your broker send them to you. We are told that brokers hold the stocks "in street name." That's not quite the full story. Trusting all those brokers to hold those stocks could get a bit unruly, so those same hidden guys (bankers) came up with another "mechanism" to deal with it. (Ensuring full control by them, of course. Here is where your stocks are held and managed: The Unknown $19 Trillion Depository Trust Company The Depository Trust Company (DTC) is the best kept secret in America. Headquartered at 55 Water Street in New York City, the average American has no clue that this financial institution is the most powerful banking corporation in the world. The general public has no knowledge of what the DTC is or what they do. How can a private banking trust company hold assets of over $19 trillion and be unknown? In a recent press release dated April 19, 1999, the Depository Trust Company stated: The Depository Trust Company (DTC) is the world's largest securities depository, holding nearly $19 trillion in assets for its Participants and their customers.... Last year, DTC processed over 164 million book-entry deliveries valued at more than $77 trillion. http://www.stockhouse.ca/bullboards/viewme...ode=1&navd=fwd& DTC maintains no records that those stocks belong to you. In a crisis such as we are analyzing here, if the brokerages go down, how do we reconcile/obtain our assets? This gets more and more scarey. We live in a world that is essentially based upon TRUST. We trust that the people we do business with will handle our problems. After 911, we were not so sure any longer that that was true. I'd like to hear some comments on this from other Stoolies. Sherlock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian4 Posted July 24, 2004 Report Share Posted July 24, 2004 Sleddy- that's a good point next week is loaded with reports most of which as you note will be down or outright awful. Last weekend I posted "get set to hear the R word again" well i have read 3 articles today saying recession dead ahead. John Maudlin in todays letter spends his whole piece talking about a recession and to his credit blasting the "Just buy and Hold Crowd" calling them criminal especially at this time and interestingly stating "We are in a secular Bear Market". Now Maudlin was Bullish as Hell during the rally but being in the Hedge Fund game he knows being wrong is ok, as long as you are not wrong long. As Art Cashin said yesterday the money is leaving the market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stained jeans Posted July 24, 2004 Report Share Posted July 24, 2004 I posted earlier that I am looking for a small bounce next week and then a sharp decline below 1000 into August. Here is another reason why I remain net short (50%) -- the RSI on the McClellan summation just fell below 70. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stained jeans Posted July 24, 2004 Report Share Posted July 24, 2004 In bull markets like last year's, it means price gains slow or stop. In bear markets it means waterfall approaching... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
threadbare Posted July 24, 2004 Report Share Posted July 24, 2004 Thanks for response. I'd love to hear more from other stoolies on this topic. Is there such a thing as a new world anymore? Perhaps it would be just as wise to stay here and look for good land with good water, pooling resources with others. Sort of like the Amish or the Mennonites, but with internet connections and entheogenic plants as well as corn and beans. Oh, and tie dye and dread locks instead of pioneer style bonnets. But the horse and buggy? Gotta love it. The Amish are going to be considered leading edge, really pushing the cultural envelope, Man. Way cool. We're all gonna party like it's 1699. I'm not leaving Canada yet, B4. I can ride out all sorts of calamities, short of a 9 plus on the richter scale. And even then, I'm not completely unprepared, as I get great practise screaming and running around in a panic, observing Greenspan opening up fissures in the economy. Damn, I wish he'd fall into one. Hey, cartoon graphic alert, where's Grot? I was checking out Costa Rica for a winter retreat, more than anything. (then started running worst case scenarios through my head). Dharmaye, Who are the Aden sisters? And Butterfield--Why so glum, chum? Cheer up. Gold is only down for a little dip. Shouldn't the miners, even the little guys do okay in the event gold hits 1500.00? Perhaps we WILL see a deflationary depression. Maybe the tiger can change it's stripes. After all, Greenspan has reversed himself before, over the course of a few decades. Maybe he'll reverse again and become the true fiscal conservative he once was. A fine dot of a man, if ever there was one. A giant among amoebic pond scum. It dawns on me that Greenspan can't lower rates or raise them. Economic policy is mirroring foreign policy. War in Iraq? Can't stay, but sure as hell can't get out. Talk about papering yourself into a corner brandishing hand grenades, in hopes of being lofted out of it by a gusher of oil. Butterfield--This might make you feel better. Marc Faber We have a righteous, intolerant and belligerent third rate intellectual who lives in a big white house, runs the world's largest economic and military power, and who has surrounded himself by some very shady characters who are also because of their complete military incompetence, and lack of any knowledge of history and understanding of geopolitical conditions very dangerous. At the same time, we also have the pleasure to regularly watch two fast-talking and squeaky clowns in the Crapvision circus who, for the last few years, have given their upbeat views on any economic, financial and political issues.------ ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I may add that I feel that the dollar has about the same downside risk against the Asian currencies as it had in 1971 against the European currencies, against which it then declined by 70% in the course of the 1970s and led to its early 1980 under-valuation. Needless to say that additional dollar weakness would add to inflationary pressures and intensify the trend toward higher interest rates. http://www.ameinfo.com/news/Detailed/42694.html All good for gold, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
traderfromhell Posted July 24, 2004 Report Share Posted July 24, 2004 I don't even own the stocks in my account as they are held "in street name", meaning the broker owns them. You own them Not your broker. When held in street name, the firm can lend them to short sellers until you sell. Let me add a bit more to this discussion of ownership of your stocks. Remember when few of us even knew that the Federal Reserve was not a Federal Agency? But we dug deeper and learned eye-opening new things. OK? Brian4 was correct. The only way to have your name on your stock certificates is to have your broker send them to you. We are told that brokers hold the stocks "in street name." That's not quite the full story. Trusting all those brokers to hold those stocks could get a bit unruly, so those same hidden guys (bankers) came up with another "mechanism" to deal with it. (Ensuring full control by them, of course. Here is where your stocks are held and managed: The Unknown $19 Trillion Depository Trust Company The Depository Trust Company (DTC) is the best kept secret in America. Headquartered at 55 Water Street in New York City, the average American has no clue that this financial institution is the most powerful banking corporation in the world. The general public has no knowledge of what the DTC is or what they do. How can a private banking trust company hold assets of over $19 trillion and be unknown? In a recent press release dated April 19, 1999, the Depository Trust Company stated: The Depository Trust Company (DTC) is the world's largest securities depository, holding nearly $19 trillion in assets for its Participants and their customers.... Last year, DTC processed over 164 million book-entry deliveries valued at more than $77 trillion. http://www.stockhouse.ca/bullboards/viewme...ode=1&navd=fwd& DTC maintains no records that those stocks belong to you. In a crisis such as we are analyzing here, if the brokerages go down, how do we reconcile/obtain our assets? This gets more and more scarey. We live in a world that is essentially based upon TRUST. We trust that the people we do business with will handle our problems. After 911, we were not so sure any longer that that was true. I'd like to hear some comments on this from other Stoolies. Sherlock Sherlock for these and other reasons I only game stocks these days with play money. Wonder where all the other investment capital goes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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